Padres acquire Milton Bradley

[HollywoodLeo]

So tell me this, reefer, who could the Padres have got instead that would have prevented the back end of the rotation/some of the relievers from regressing from they were doing before the trade?

Who could they have acquired instead of Milton Bradley that would have prevented the rest of the offense from getting even worse than they had been prior to the trade?

You keep conveniently neglecting the fact that the rest of the team regressed a bit in the process just to attempt to make your argument seem stronger.

By your logic the Padres could have acquired Alex Rodriguez at the deadline and you would have liked it because "it won't help a thing"

And no, i'm not comparing Milton Bradley to Alex Rodriguez.

But in this short time frame he's played about that good.

[love_that_reefer]

So you think Bradley was an impact player? You think guys on the team were jumping through hoops to get Milton ****ing Bradley? I am not neglecting your point. I have been responding by saying he's not a guy people are afraid of and that players weren't praying the front office to get. Adam Dunn was available and would have helped a shit load protecting Gonzalez who is one of your best hitters. Plus he would have made Petco look like a sand box and made the others around him better. He's a producer and a big name that pitchers fear. Now you can go compare numbers between Dunn and Bradley since the 7th, it doesn't matter. I am sure Dunn has produced more but it doesn't matter. Dunn is an impact guy in a lineup such as the Padres. The front office would sent a big message to that team and the players would most likely play better.

By your logic the Padres could have acquired Alex Rodriguez at the deadline and you would have liked it because "it won't help a thing"

No, Rodriguez is a huge name and someone every pitcher fears . If you guys got Arod, I would say "Welcome to the Playoffs"

[padrefanforever]

I'd say welcome to payroll handcuffs for the next 7 years

[HollywoodLeo]

So you think Bradley was an impact player? You think guys on the team were jumping through hoops to get Milton ****ing Bradley? I am not neglecting your point. I have been responding by saying he's not a guy people are afraid of and that players weren't praying the front office to get. Adam Dunn was available and would have helped a shit load protecting Gonzalez who is one of your best hitters. Plus he would have made Petco look like a sand box and made the others around him better. He's a producer and a big name that pitchers fear. Now you can go compare numbers between Dunn and Bradley since the 7th, it doesn't matter. I am sure Dunn has produced more but it doesn't matter. Dunn is an impact guy in a lineup such as the Padres. The front office would sent a big message to that team and the players would most likely play better.



No, Rodriguez is a huge name and someone every pitcher fears . If you guys got Arod, I would say "Welcome to the Playoffs"

How many teams that were out to acquire Bradley and how many pitchers that are "afraid" of him are irrelevant.

Milton Bradley has done more for the Padres than Adam Dunn would have.

Do I expect that to keep up? Probably not....but in the meantime that's what he's done.

Is it a coincidence that Adrian Gonzalez, who according to you Milton Bradley can't "protect", has hit better when Milton's in the line up?

[HollywoodLeo]

No, Rodriguez is a huge name and someone every pitcher fears . If you guys got Arod, I would say "Welcome to the Playoffs"

True, I have no doubt you would have said that.

Which would be funny because the Padres would probably have the same record during the same time frame had they acquired A-Rod but not Milton.

They might have won an extra game or two, but it wouldn't have been all that much different.

[JayDawg27]

It's obvious to me that the Padres have not done any better since his arrival which makes my point.

Okay guys you are all going to strangle me for this, BUT, I went and pulled some stats to prove Reefer wrong one last time and well to be honest with you it backfired on me.

We picked MB up on July 1, he immediately went on the DL and cam back in July 7.

Our record on July 6 was 48-37 or .565

Since then we have gone 24-22 or .522

MB has played in 31 games since July 6th and our record in the games he has played in is 17-14 or .548

So, statistically speaking reefer has a very valid point because since MB has been here and for the games he has played in, our record is actually worse than it was before he joined the team.

It can very legitimately be argued that his joining the team, by coincidence, coincided with the decline of our pitching so it looks worse, and that we would be much worse off if he wasnt on the team, but it can not be PROVEN that thats the case, so I think at this point we have to agree that each side has a valid point and opinion and maybe we should stop slinging the mud and start moving on to another topic...

I would like to point out though that our record for August thus far is 16-9 or .640 which is awesome...

[HollywoodLeo]

I had no doubt whatsoever that Reefer wasn't lying in regards to the Padres record since his acquisition.

The point I keep trying to stress is that....that's irrelevant.

Milton Bradley can not win games on his own. It's not Milton Bradley's fault that the back end of the rotation (David Wells, Justin Germano, various scrubs filling in for Chris Young) all proceeded to suck.

It's not Milton Bradley's fault that an impotent offense somehow found a way to get worse (for a stretch of time)

Both of the above would have happened even if they got A-Rod instead of Milton Bradley.

All Milton Bradley has done is hit the ball and post a 1.138 OPS (not factoring in the past two games) since he's been here.

Anyone who says that that's not helping the Padres is just being foolish.

Reefer wants to argue that the Milton Bradley acquisition did nothing for the Padres because other players have done less since then as compared to what they did beforehand.

[HollywoodLeo]

Judging one offensive player on his team's win/loss record is worse than, say, judging a pitcher off his team's win/loss record.

I've always argued that a pitcher's W/L stat is overrated, but at least one can make the argument that he touches the ball for every play.

[JayDawg27]

And my point, trying to keep an open mind and see it from both sides, is that Reefers arguement is that the Padres have not played better since acquiring MB, and he's right to some degree.

Now whether the pitching is to blame, whether the other hitters are to blame, or any other factor is all speculation because no body here can prove their point at all. He cant even prove that Dunn would have made a bigger difference or A-Rod would have.

So my bigger point is this:

This lame ass arguement has gone on for way too long because each side has valid points to support their arguement/opinion and thats all it is si why keep arguing it because neither side is going to change their tune.

MOVE ON ALREADY!!!

[MrPadre19]

" As for Mr. Padre, what?"

What are you having trouble understanding?
You're trying to say that MB hasn't made any difference to the Padres offense,yet guys ON THE TEAM have come out publicly and said that he has.I would have to say that they would know if he has better than any of us......wouldn't you?

And JD,I can appreciate you looking at both sides,I would hope we all do.But,since MB joined the Team the Pitching has not been the same as before.He can't be held accountable for that....can he?
The reason our record isn't much better is not because of the offense....there's no question the offense has improved.
Look at it this way,with the way the pitching has been,isn't it possible that our record could be a whole lot "worse" if not for Milton Bradley?
If so....doesn't that mean that he has made a difference?!
There's no guarantee that adding "any" one player will make a difference in wins & losses.....there are too many other factors involved in "winning".But,you can measure whether any one player has affected certain aspects of the game...like offense,or defense for instance.
I'm still not sure how you can argue that MB hasn't made a difference to the Padres "offense"!

[love_that_reefer]

Throughout this whole piece I have made it clear what my intentions are with the statement in question and proved that it hasn't changed anything like I said. We can all speculate and bullshit like we have been but nothing has changed period. You can try and try all day but it still doesn't change the facts. And to say Dunn wouldn't have done anything near Bradley is absurd! You guys act as if I am blaming Bradley for their poor play. They have been playing mediocre ball since he came to town. I am completely done with this since most of this has come to complete speculation and not facts. Respond if you must but I will not be reading.

As for Mr. Padre, back up your claims in the future.

Great point and I am taking your advice Jaydawg. Until the next debate, I bid you all farewell.

[JayDawg27]

Yes all things being equal before he joined the team and after he joined, I agree and argued earlier that this team would be in a solid first place with a much better record.

BUT, and thats a big BUT, that didnt happen, and thats not the case, so it's all just specualtion which does give a marginal amount of credence to Reefers position doesnt it???

In other words we cannot just sit here and tell him he's absolutely wrong, and just say nope to dope and ugh to drugs, when we will never know if he is right or we are, because if you look at the teams stats as part of the arguments, he has a point.

I would love it if we had a stat geek here who could post an overall picture of offensive, defensive, and win stats pre-MB and post-MB so we could get a better picture of this.

[MrPadre19]

"As for Mr. Padre, back up your claims in the future."

Huh?
What claim are you referring too?
seriously....you have me confused.

[MrPadre19]

Since the All-Star break Milton Bradley is hitting,347 with an OPS of 1.108!
Compare that to Sledge/Cruz/Boca and you're gonna say that he isn't making a difference to the offense.
Does that "back up my claim"?
Game winning homeruns,RBI's in clutch situations,these are things we weren't getting from our leftfielders "before" Bradley.
I still don't get how this is such a volatile discussion.
Everything is a matter of opinion...it kinda goes without saying on a message board.
But those numbers.....TO ME.....IMO......leave little doubt he has made a difference.
Whether anyone agrees with me or not I don't really care....again....not sure why all the hate?

[HollywoodLeo]

And my point, trying to keep an open mind and see it from both sides, is that Reefers arguement is that the Padres have not played better since acquiring MB, and he's right to some degree.

I have a very open mind and I perfectly understand the argument Reefer is trying to make.

It's just that I have viewed the argument and dismissed it as it doesn't make any sense.

Now whether the pitching is to blame, whether the other hitters are to blame, or any other factor is all speculation because no body here can prove their point at all. He cant even prove that Dunn would have made a bigger difference or A-Rod would have.

While it's true I can not prove how Dunn or A-Rod would have fared in Milton's place, I can say with confidence that the odds are against them having done much better than what Milton has done.

Milton doing what he's done hasn't caused the Padres to win more than what they have with him here, so how am I supposed to believe anyone else being there would make it any different?

It's painfully obvious that the reason the Padres haven't won more is not because of anything Milton's not doing, or anything someone else would have done in his place.

At least IMO

So my bigger point is this:

This lame ass arguement has gone on for way too long because each side has valid points to support their arguement/opinion and thats all it is si why keep arguing it because neither side is going to change their tune.

I agree that it's gone on way too long because it's like talking to a brick wall to me.

And I disagree, Reefer's point is not valid.

MOVE ON ALREADY!!!

It's what I intend on doing.