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San Francisco GiantsNo wonder they call you Sabermetrician.
Jeez...
No wonder they call you Sabermetrician.
Jeez...
"Players can't get better over time." -GiantsFanatic
Willis had a good game today as he looks to be the favorite now.
I am pretty sure all these stats are up to date.
Code:(Italicized teal text indicates who has the advantage for the particular category. Italicized blue text indicates a tie.) Clemens ERA: 1.87 W-L: 13-8 (RS: 3.58) IP: 211.1 IP CG: 1 AVG: .198 K/9: 7.88 WHIP: 1.01 XBH: 40 OBP: .261 SLG: .284 OPS: .544 Carpenter ERA: 2.83 W-L: 21-5 (RS: 5.51) IP: 241.2 IP CG: 7 AVG: .231 K/9: 7.93 WHIP: 1.06 XBH: 67 OBP: .273 SLG: .351 OPS: .623 Willis ERA: 2.63 W-L: 22-10 (RS: 4.87) IP: 236.1 IP CG: 7 AVG: .240 K/9: 6.80 WHIP: 1.12 XBH: 62 OBP: .290 SLG: .346 OPS: .636 Key: ERA: Earned Run Average. W-L: Win Loss Record. RS: Run Support While Pitching. IP: Innings pitched. AVG: Opponents batting average against. K/9: Strikeouts per 9 Innings. WHIP: Walks+Hits/Innings Pitched. XBH: Extra base hits allowed. OBP: On Base Percentage Against. SLG: Slugging Percentage Allowed. OPS: On-Base Percentage+Slugging Percentage Against.
.: My Last.fm
I am pulling for Carp
Clemens is old
There's no way a guy whose ERA is close to 3 should get it over two other guys. And there's no way a guy with 13 wins will get it. Willis wins by default, alas.
I see no one could take me up on my challenge of any statistic beating winning. Many, continue spouting all your nonsense and I'll continue supporting wins and winning. In the end I will always support the best, while much of the time most of you will support the losers. How apropo for many of you. Carpenter win NL Cy Young and either Colon or Rivera get the AL.
Rivera doesn't have as many wins as Colon, ha!Originally Posted by ejk
I agree, that is why Colon may win the award, but many voters think Rivera should. It is up to them. I haven't figured out how many saves are worth a win, if any.
To do that, you'd have to use ... oh my god, statistics. So you might as well just forget it.
I have read your challenge to the forum ejk. Great job. No one was willing or able to take you up on your challenge beacuse you buried them with fact. A win trumps any other stat on earth. You chased the stat head back under their rocks.
Your assessment of the pitching award appears to be very accurate. I tend to agree. Please post more often if you see fit. I love the way a few very ignorant people feel we are one in the same.
Anyone out there willing to take on the challenge of beating the WIN METHOD with stats? It appears not. Winning always determines the best, and that is why the Cy Young goes to a pitcher with WINS or a overwhelming closer who sayes many WINS. I guess we have to start looking under rocks.
You show me a pitcher who gets any of those things without other players playing on the field with him, and then I will give you and your win method credit in judgement of an individual player's greatness....
Wins determine the prowess of an entire team unit, however some of the greatest players have not and do not play on the greatest teams in their time... individual greatness is not indicative of team greatness, and vice versa....
Since the object of baseball is to win and not for any individual to amass any amount of individual stats, winning DOES indicate the TRUE greatness of a player and of a team. The truly greatest players help their team WIN, thereby making them the truly greatest. I will never argue, and do accept the point that many a great player could not help their team win. They were not the greatest at what baseball is played for however. Now don't go blaming the other guys on the team again.
No... it does not... the object of the TEAM is to obtain a win... since the individual does not play BY HIMSELF, it is impossible for an individual player to play for a win... the individual can only add to the team effort, with his individual performance at his position... in the hopes that that effort, plus the efforts of others, will result in a win (which is why many times a team of above average players will beat a team of 1 superstar amungst 24 average to poor players)
The greatest players give their team a better CHANCE of winning, by excelling at their individual position, in their individual at bats, or their indvidual pitching efforts....
A pitcher cannot win the game by himself, alone on the field, even if he were able to obtain 27 straight strikeouts... for there would be nobody to catch the ball, hence the batter would go to the bases every time.... the WIN on a pitchers stat sheet is partially his credit, and partially the rest of the team's credit.... a great pitcher can have a losing record if the team surrounding him is horrid... that pitcher can do everything within his ability, pitch a masterpiece, and still lose.. that does not lessen the greatness of said pitcher....
team greatness is measured on wins/championships
individual greatness is measured on individual effort/performance, and added to with wins/championships/awards/etc
As stated.. unless you can show a time where a single player single-handedly won a game, alone on the field.. wins cannot define the greatness of the individual in the team sport
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