The Contending Pittsburgh Pirates

[Tobywan]

Pirates are rallying, 10-3 now.

[Sabu88]

I remember my first beer

How was it? Was it a cheap one in high school that your buddy got from his older brother while you were smoking skunk weed in the attic... or was it fine dining at Applebees?

Contenders:
St. Louis, Philly, Atlanta

Pirates record against them in that stretch? 3-7.

Yippee!!!!

quality pitcher in Zambrano beating them 1-0 in the 4th. Seems about right.

[love_that_reefer]

There's the negativity!!!

[Sabu88]

There's the negativity!!!

and there are your emoticons.

How is your boyfriend, Brandon Wood, doing?
.222? Your loins must be on fire. SO CHEAP! SO MUCH BETTER than andy laroche.

I wasn't getting fooled.

[love_that_reefer]

He's doing alright on a team that has improved dramatically

[Sabu88]

Not hard to go anywhere but up from 100 loss seasons. The Pirates won 70 games in the past. That sure got them far.

Hey I remember when you said Jeff Karstens would have an ERA in the low 2s.

As GM, I definitely wouldn't have done this:
Pirates and RHP Jeff Karstens avoided arbitration Thursday by agreeing to a one-year, $1.1 million contract.

- LTR

ouch.

Hey remember when you said Charlie Mortons ERA would drop almost 5 runs from last year?

Hey remember when I said the Pirates would overpay for Kevin Correia?

Oh wait...they actually did that.

Hey remember when you said the Pirates spent too much for Correia?
Remember when I told you before that how the Pirates need to offer more money to free agents because their team is so bad?

Remember when you said Correia would have an all-star first half?

...and then give $4 million/season to Correia for no apparent reason. I had Correia on my list but couldn't even fathom him making more than $2 million TOPS!

Remember when he came back down to earth during the second half and the Pirates began a 5 game losing streak?

oh yeah..


So yeah...I think it's cute and all that the Pirates wont lose 100000 games this year like last year. Some players internally have improved on their abysmal seasons a year ago. The extra wins are fine and dandy..are the Pirates any closer to the Phillies, Yankees, Red Sox, etc. than they were a year ago? Not really.

With the exception of Correia's first half, none of the players that the Pirates picked up have changed this team for the better.

Certainly none of your magical super powered players like your lover Brandon Wood <3 , Paul, Overbay, Ciriacio, Diaz did anything to make this team any better than the bullshit they had last year.
We already established these players were more expensive ANYWAYS.

The Pirates failed to improve their future this season. They had a golden opportunity at the trade deadline to do just that by trading players who were playing and are playing above their heads(Maholm, Correia, etc).

The Pirates wont pay Paul Maholm past his 9million dollar option year next year...unless they can extend him for less money.

Charlie Morton has regressed from his first months success.

Kevin Correia isnt in the future plans of the team and as his numbers come back down to earth, his trade value will plummet.

I really have become a fan of Jeff Karstens. I dont know if this ERA in the 2s will be an every year type thing.

The team still has questions about the offense. Alvarez still has huge question marks. Walker (Littlefield pick) seems like a solid 2B at the plate. His glove is questionable.

The catching situation is a mess. Tony Sanchez (Huntington pick..signability) is a joke as predicted.

Tabata regressed from his rookie year and has been injured a lot recently. INJURY PRONE!!!!!!!!(@*!*@(!*@!(@ 2

Presley seems like he can be a nice player..oh wait that was a littlefield pick too.

The Pirates long term success is in question.

[love_that_reefer]

Ahhhhh yes, here comes Sabu in the midst of a 5 game losing streak where it's convenient but was MIA when the Pirates were in first place. Weird isn't it?? And now you chalk it up to "Not hard to go anywhere but up from 100 loss seasons." Priceless

Unlike you I can admit when I was wrong and I was wrong Karstens but was right about getting rid of the Pirate busts. Correia might have been an overpay but still better paying him than Zach Duke.

I could go back and point all the things you said that were wrong but I don't care to because the Pirates have done everything you said they wouldn't. The Pirates are headed in the right direction and I am loving it!

[Sabu88]

Herka Derka the Pirates were in first place in June! WHERE WERE YOU!??

Hey good for you. I really dont see how you disproved any of my points...but okay.

At least you've changed your get-up from before the season

"THE PIRATES ARE BUYERS. MAGICAL PLAYERS ARE COMING <EMOTICON>" to

"THE PIRATES ARE MOVING IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION <EMOTICON>"

At least the magical players talk is out the door. That was getting annoying.

[love_that_reefer]

What points did you make exactly? Only thing annoying is your denial. I have always said the Pirates were headed in the right direction

Pirates through 108 games in 2010- 38-70
Pirates through 108 games in 2011- 54-54

You're right, the Pirates did nothing right and I was wrong about everything.

[Sabu88]

What points did you make exactly? Only thing annoying is your denial. I have always said the Pirates were headed in the right direction

Pirates through 108 games in 2010- 38-70
Pirates through 108 games in 2011- 54-54

You're right, the Pirates did nothing right and I was wrong about everything.

well you kind of were.

Facts
1. The Pirates replaced rostered players with more expensive less productive players. - You believed the Pirates could magically replace these players with cheaper and better players. Wrong.

2. The Pirates improvement record wise has more to do with the sudden success of Jeff Karstens, Charlie Mortons good few months, Kevin Correia's first half, and the pure suckitude of the NL Central than any clear improvements of the team in general. None of these things you said would.

3. You believed the Pirates were "buyers" this offseason. - They spent around the same amount of money.

4. You were fooled. - I told you not to get fooled

5. Before the season, Neil Huntington showed that his trading ability is moderate. His ability to sign relievers is good. His inability in signing position players and his certain knack for overpaying aging veterans is still strong (This again is because the Pirates have to overpay to get players to come to the team..something I stated). - You believe the team is going in the right direction. Turns out that Huntingtons ability to sign relievers is still good (Veras, Resop). His inability in signing position players is still an inability (Overbay, Diaz) and his knack for overpaying aging veterans is still strong (Correia, Overbay, Diaz).

[love_that_reefer]

1. You're facts need work. Correia was cheaper and replaced Duke. Milledge, LaRoche and Young aren't even playing baseball right now. Nothing magical about it, just cutting the fat.

2. The Pirates improvement also goes toward McCutchen improving and Clint Hurdle helping get rid of that loser attitude. All things I said would happen. Yes, the Central is weaker but the Pirates pitching is 1.5 runs lower in ERA than last year, something I would said would improve with Duke gone. I didn't see the ERA improving as much though. And yes, I did mention the Central would be weaker.

3. The Pirates were buyers compared to you saying they should do nothing.

4. I'm not fooled. I knew improvement was on the way.

5. The team is going in the right direction with young players getting better, good coaching, better drafts and better scouting. With players seeing how the Pirates are on the rise, Pirates become better looking to free agents and have more of a willingness to sign there. Huntington just got Lee and Ludwick for basically nothing. While those moves are marginal at best, Huntington still didn't have to give up anything to get them. That's an improvement right there. I understand your negativity being that the Pirates have sucked for so long but the Pirates are getting better.

[Sabu88]

1. You're facts need work. Correia was cheaper and replaced Duke. Milledge, LaRoche and Young aren't even playing baseball right now. Nothing magical about it, just cutting the fat.

2. The Pirates improvement also goes toward McCutchen improving and Clint Hurdle helping get rid of that loser attitude. All things I said would happen. Yes, the Central is weaker but the Pirates pitching is 1.5 runs lower in ERA than last year, something I would said would improve with Duke gone. I didn't see the ERA improving as much though.

3. The Pirates were buyers compared to you saying they should do nothing.

4. I'm not fooled. I knew improvement was on the way.

5. The team is going in the right direction with young players getting better, good coaching, better drafts and better scouting. With players seeing how the Pirates are on the rise, Pirates become better looking to free agents and have more of a willingness to sign there. Huntington just got Lee and Ludwick for basically nothing. While those moves are marginal at best, Huntington still didn't have to give up anything to get them. That's an improvement right there. I understand your negativity being that the Pirates have sucked for so long but the Pirates are getting better.

1.

Yeah I'm sorry a Pirate fan would care what he was doing outside of a Pirate uniform.

What those "scrubs" did in 2010 exceeds what the Pirates players they replaced have done in 2011. Why is that such a hard concept to grasp? I'm not supposed to care what those players do outside a Pirates uniform, right?

Correia 2011 (before the shelling by the Cubs) 0.4 WAR
Duke (2010) -0.8 WAR

That 1.2 win difference is really making ends meet.

2. Mccutchen is a superstar in the making. That was never challenged Ever.

On Hurdle: Jim Tracy got a 37-35 record out of his team in the 2nd half. What's your point?

The Pirates have a new coach. Once that luster wears off and some of the starting pitchers come back down to earth, it'll be same old Pirates.

You must not follow the Pirates. They always show a glimpse or two a season then tank. They always tank.

Oh my god! Who was the genius who said that?


3) I never said the Pirates wouldn't sign ANYBODY? LOL! Obviously roster spots have to be filled. I simply said they would have a hard time

Logically, these mysterious cheaper more talented players wouldn't provide much more wins in the stat column for the Pirates. Even a player like Cliff Lee would probably only give the Pirates +5 wins max. Teams like the Pirates who have to invest their money wisely and guess when they'll be competitive don't have this option.

Turns out none of the free agents they signed made significant impacts. They pretty much broke even in their spending by trading Duke. If that means they're buyers...whatever floats your boat. Lyle Overbay! MATT DIAZ! We are going to win now!

The Pirates replaced crap with more crap. Who said they would do that?

Your definition of buyers is laughable. Yeah...spending 1.5 million dollars more in free agency.

4. Lol?
5. Didnt I make you try to quantify this before and you ended up saying like Garrett Jones was the future?

The scouting department has been doing very well the past few season too so that isn't accurate.

lol. You mean they did well in scouting and signing/trading for Ryan Church, Matt Diaz, Aki, Overbay, Wood, Ciriacio, Paul,Laroche, Crosby, etc.? You mean all those guys they traded for and signed as free agents? Half of those guys you think are worthless? I hope they just didnt pick out those players from a hat or something. Somebody had to do some scouting there.

[Sabu88]

1. You're facts need work.

MY NAME IS FACTS NEED WORK! Somebody who is an admin change it now!

[love_that_reefer]

1. No, the 2010 scrubs have not exceeded 2011 replacement players and you have already pointed that out. I love it when you make my points for me.

2. You are no genius so please don't call yourself that. Hurdle has better players on his team and the players believe in him. The clubhouse is totally different under Hurdle than with Tracy. The Pirates have won almost as many games as they won all of last year.

3. I can't deny that Overbay and Diaz have been stinkers but at least the Pirates went out tried compared to your.....nothing! You would have bitched and moaned if they signed Derrek Lee in the offseason and you know it!

4. Grown men saying "lol" still makes me shiver with fright.

5. No, I said Walker, McCutchen, Hanrahan and your top prospects were the future. I might have said Jones should be playing RF and under control but not the future.

I am done debating the obvious with you because it's utterly pointless. You have your view of negativity and I have a view of what's actually happening. We're not going to see eye to eye but let's please keep in touch!! I want to be there when the Pirates finish 20+ games better than they did last year.

[Sabu88]

I am done debating the obvious with you because it's utterly pointless.

Thanks. I'll enjoy this 20th losing season too.

I find a grown man who makes their screen name "love_that_reefer" a little more childish than saying "lol"