And I stand by the position that Cincinnati will NEVER become a major player in the Big East and the NCAA tournament with Mick Cronin at the helm. His only head coaching experience was at Murray State, not exactly a powerhouse in Division 1. They may have good moral players, but a lot of times, good moral players don't win you games.
Just look at the Bengals.
rf28
So young head coaches never become good because they are at a small school at some point?
If that were the case, there wouldn't be many good coaches.
Just not seeing your logic.
CNNSI recently ranked Mick as the sixth most "upcoming" head coach under 40 or something like that.
Anyway, he has some nice players coming in next year.
He was the primary recruiter of players like Logan, Satterfield, etc. (top 5 classes in two of his final three years at UC I believe...and that was before UC was in the Big East) and a couple top 10 ones at UL while he was Pitino's assistant.
Pitino gave him a ringing endorsement, for the record.
The Simpson family gathers around, as Homer places Bart's passed test on the fridge.)
Homer: We're proud of you, boy.
Bart: Thanks, Dad. But part of this D-minus belongs to God.
My point is that UC should have hired a coach that could have gotten this team in the elite 8 or higher THIS SEASON. They took a step backward by hiring Cronin IMHO from where Huggins had this team (14 or 15 straight NCAA tournament appearances).
rf28
As I read this last sentence I can't help but laugh.....Just a few short weeks ago, I mentioned that Bill Cowher and Brian Billick gave a ringing endorsement for Marvin Lewis being a head coach. And you said something to the effect of.....of course they would, they didn't want a good coach coaching against them in the same division.......I just find it ironic that you now use the opposite of that argument to make a point about Cronin. You apparently are a walking contradiction.Originally Posted by CincyRedsFan30
So young head coaches never become good because they are at a small school at some point?
If that were the case, there wouldn't be many good coaches.
Just not seeing your logic.
CNNSI recently ranked Mick as the sixth most "upcoming" head coach under 40 or something like that.
Anyway, he has some nice players coming in next year.
He was the primary recruiter of players like Logan, Satterfield, etc. (top 5 classes in two of his final three years at UC I believe...and that was before UC was in the Big East) and a couple top 10 ones at UL while he was Pitino's assistant.
Pitino gave him a ringing endorsement, for the record.
And as far as your criticism of Tubby Smith. In 9 seasons at Kentucky he has averaged 26.7 wins per season. Let's take a look at other notable good coaches with their average wins per season at their current school:
Lute Olson (ARIZ) 24.7
Coach K (DUKE) 25.19
Jim Boeheim (SYR) 24.24
Ben Howland (UCLA) 25
Billy Donovan (FLA) 22.6
Rick Pitino (UL) 23.6
Tom Izzo (MSU) 23.6
Don't make remarks insinuating that Tubby can't coach. his record speaks for itself.
Also, while I do think that Cronin will be a good fit in Cincinnati......remember he played a huge role in landing some thuggish recruits while an assistant at Cincinnati. Here is a paragraph from his own bio.
"Cronin launched his coaching career on the college level in 1997-98 at Cincinnati when he was promoted from video coordinator to assistant coach. He made an immediate impact as a recruiter, playing a key role in signing five Bearcats who went on to be NBA draft picks: Steve Logan, two-time Conference USA Player of the Year (Golden State); DerMarr Johnson, Parade Magazine National Prep Player of the Year and C-USA Freshman of the Year (Atlanta); Pete Mickeal, a junior college national player of the year selection (Dallas); Kenny Satterfield, a McDonald's All-American (Dallas); and Jason Maxiell (Detroit)."
Mostly mediocre draft picks, and Logan never even played.
Marshall: MILSWANCAs?
Ted: Wait, I can get this. Mothers I'd like to sleep with and never call again.
Barney: Circle gets the square!
The 2074 MSL NL Gold Glove Recipient at Third Base.
No one was going to get UC into the elite eight or higher this season under the circumstances.
Do you actually think anyone could have put together a better team THIS season?
He had ONE player on the roster in essence...in March.
Recruting typically lasts for a while and he had to cobble together a team after almost every recruit was signed, forcing him to get a bunch of JUCO players.
Huggins never walked into a situation with no players on a roster a few months before the season began, and I'm also not getting the Elite Eight comment considering Huggins hadn't made one in years (almost never past the 2nd Round over the last seven or eight years of his tenure).
The Simpson family gathers around, as Homer places Bart's passed test on the fridge.)
Homer: We're proud of you, boy.
Bart: Thanks, Dad. But part of this D-minus belongs to God.
I'm just saying what myself and many other UK fans feel.
Many at the school want him gone because he doesn't live up to expecations of UK fans.
His NCAA Tournament performance has not satisfied many fans in recent years.
For supposedly being one of the most "attractive" school choices (with the tradition UK has)Tubby has seemed unable to get the best recruits, particularly over the last few years.
And you're right about the Lewis comparison. You thought it was valid when you said it. Shouldn't it be valid when I say it too?
The Simpson family gathers around, as Homer places Bart's passed test on the fridge.)
Homer: We're proud of you, boy.
Bart: Thanks, Dad. But part of this D-minus belongs to God.
I'm not arguing that, but we know who had final say over those decisions at that time. The captain of the ship, so to speak.
Anyway, Zimpher will be furious unless scholar athletes are recruited, so I'm sure Mick will try his best to bring them in.
From what I have heard and seen this year, this group seems like a pretty well-behaved and good group academically as well.
I expect more of the same in the future based on what I've heard of the incoming recruits for next season.
The Simpson family gathers around, as Homer places Bart's passed test on the fridge.)
Homer: We're proud of you, boy.
Bart: Thanks, Dad. But part of this D-minus belongs to God.
And I guarantee Mick will recruit quality players to play COLLEGE basketball, which is different from the NBA.
When Mick is doing some very notable thing in a few years (more often than Huggins IMO), I will be sure to bring this issue up to life.
He just has that "feel" of a winner to me, similar to the feeling I have had about Walt Jocketty for years.
The Simpson family gathers around, as Homer places Bart's passed test on the fridge.)
Homer: We're proud of you, boy.
Bart: Thanks, Dad. But part of this D-minus belongs to God.
As an alumni of UK (and big time fan),I would say the bulk of Tubbys criticism comes from his style of play not being like Rick Pitino. And, unfortunately I think that there is a bit of a racism factor on behalf of the fans. The fact is that during Tubbys' career at the University of Kentucky he has averaged 26.7 wins per season......which of the top of my head would probably be about the top 5 in college basketball over those 9 years.
I'm certainly not sitting here saying that Tubby is the end all be all, as we have struggled from time to time in the tournament. I just don't feel the FIRETUBBY websites are justified. Anyway, just my 2 cents
It seems more have been upset with his recruiting in recent years. They think he has missed out on some good recruits, such as Lofton (in-state) and others and that he should be able to attract some of the best to UK.
One thing I found interesting in that regard is when UC added Hernol Hall (even though he was ruled inelligible), Mick was quoted as saying Tubby told him this summer UK couldn't even get a visit from him. That's pretty interesting based on the very short period of time Mick had to recruit players for this season.
The Simpson family gathers around, as Homer places Bart's passed test on the fridge.)
Homer: We're proud of you, boy.
Bart: Thanks, Dad. But part of this D-minus belongs to God.
The recruiting style kind of goes hand in hand with the style of play. Tubby teaches team basketball and essentially has no stars....thus the major recruits are looking to go elsewhere. Even though this is happening Tubby is still averaging 26.7 wins a year. Thanks for adding more substance to my side of the argument. My goodness, Tubby is winning 26.7 games per year with less talented players......He must be a good coach. Trust me, the people that have a beef with Tubby is more related to the style of play and/or the color of his skin.
I think some people get tired of his "defensive style," such as the one we're seeing on display so far today.
Yeah, I said that. Hernol was ruled inelligble because he played in a league in his home country that they considered "professional" or something along those lines. It's not like he's had any behavioral issues.
In fact, here isinformation on the ruling from the UC site:
Hernol Hall Ruled Ineligible
Bearcats Lose 6-10 Newcomer
Nov. 18, 2006
CINCINNATI, Ohio -- University of Cincinnati junior Hernol Hall has been ruled ineligible by the National Collegiate Athletics Association due to his basketball participation in foreign competition.
The NCAA determined that Hall had exhausted his eligibility due to Rule 14.2.3.5, which assesses a season of eligibility for each 12-month period that the individual competed in organized outside competition after the individual's 21st birthday. In addition to his two seasons of junior college competition at Lon Morris College, Hall, 24, played on the Costa Rica national team and on a team in Nicarugua.
The University of Cincinnati filed a waiver to try and have Hall granted relief from 14.2.3.5 (participation after the 21st birthday rule), but that request has been denied by the NCAA's Administrative Review Subcommittee.
Maggie McKinley, UC's Director of Compliance and Student Services, managed the process of appeal on behalf of Hall.
"During the certification process for his eligibility, it was determined that Hernol Hall played in organized basketball competition with Tiburones of Nicarugua and the Costa Rican national team during two calendar years after his 21st birthday" said McKinley. "NCAA Bylaw 14.2.3.5 states that for each calendar year that a prospect participates in any organized competition after their 21st birthday and before their initial enrollment in college, the prospect is charged with a season of eligibility. Since Hernol participated in two calendar years after turning 21 and he competed two years at Lon Morris College, he has exhausted his four years of collegiate eligibility."
"Coach Cronin and his staff were forced to recruit under unusual and exceptional time constraints and we signed nine excellent student-athletes," stated UC Director of Athletics Mike Thomas. "Under even the best of circumstances, recruiting international students presents some very unique challenges. My heart goes out to Hernol and the rest of our men's basketball family who were all under the impression that Hernol had eligibility remaining."
Head Coach Mick Cronin stated, "We are extremely disappointed with the outcome of Hernol's appeal. Hernol is a great player and an even better person and will remain a Bearcat. We will work with him everyday and continue to help him chase his dreams as a student and then as a professional player. Hernol is concerned about his teammates and has been through so much in his life that this is only a minor setback for him. When we told him, his main concern was us, he feels like he let us down, which we told him was not the case. Hernol will have no comment at this time. His entire story is very compelling and he will have his say when he is ready, right now he wants to be with his teammates."
Cronin added that "This is an unfortunate situation to say the least and we are not happy about losing arguably our best player and top recruit. That said, we will continue to work hard and build our program back to national prominence."
UC Athletics is currently waiting on the appeal of a second newcomer, Adam Hrycaniuk, a 6-10, 230-pound forward from Mysliborz, Poland. The NCAA began the process of reviewing Hrycaniuk's appeal on Thursday. "We remain very optimistic about Adam's appeal and hope to have an answer before our next game on Tuesday night against Wofford", said Cronin.
"I want to thank our administration and compliance department for the work they have put in on these cases to help our student-athletes" says Cronin. "Our fans need to know that we have done everything possible to help these guys and despite the outcome of this case our future is bright."
The Simpson family gathers around, as Homer places Bart's passed test on the fridge.)
Homer: We're proud of you, boy.
Bart: Thanks, Dad. But part of this D-minus belongs to God.
NOTE: there is a reason why I deleted my original post regarding Hall. I wasn't privy to his story went back and looked at it and realized it wasn't an appropriate correlation
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