Schilling gets lit up

[Hmark6]

At least he gave up that game-winning bomb to a guy he has a great deal of respect for...

All smack aside, I'm confued as to why Mike Timlin doesn't even get a crack at being the closer. Curt is not himself as he demonstrated last night, but Timlin has been there all year mowing guys down. Schill's got a broke wheel, and looked a little more portly than I remember. He was throwing 88 MPH batting practice. Curt lives in the mid 90s and that sets up every other ball he throws. If that fastball isn't popping, Curt is very hittable. Timlin has been great all year, and doesn't even get a shot? Beyond me... As a Yankee fan I hope Francona keeps running him out there.

Fear not Sox fan, you get to watch Tim Redding throw BP tonight..

[Providence A's]

I was glad to hear Schilling got shelled...he's a blowhard...Timlin would have been my choice. Schilling has never been a closer and I can't seem him thriving in that role.

[Hmark6]

I was glad to hear Schilling got shelled...he's a blowhard...Timlin would have been my choice. Schilling has never been a closer and I can't seem him thriving in that role.

Well, if he gets back in shape he could be one of the best closers in the league, but wouldn't you rather, if you were a Sox fan, have him lock up a team for 7-8 innings rather than coming in the 9th? I mean, what can Schilling do in the 9th that Timlin can't?

[Providence A's]

Right; it's a waste as he still is an effective starter. And I didn't think they were paying him that much money to close.

oh, and the same can be said about many starting pitchers (becoming a good closer)...

[Hmark6]

oh, and the same can be said about many starting pitchers (becoming a good closer)...

Absolutely. The question then becomes who's going to get the first 24 outs?

[Fishercat]

Wow, that's smart, posting a topic title "Schilling gets lit up" in the Sox forum.

[Fishercat]

On the closer note: If Schilling cannot be effective for one inning, then why would he be effective for 7 or 8? That's their thinking. He won't be in there permanently, only to get his strength up.

Last night, Francona's hands were tied. If you check Timlin's game log, he is often only good for about one inning. When you get later on (in this case, 2 innings), he becomes weaker, giving up runs at a worse rate. There are no other reliable arms in that pen unless you want to trust Jeremi Gonzalez or something. You have Timlin after an inning, a new pitcher, or Schilling. Schill gives the best chance.

I can see the concept of Timlin in the closer role, but you simply cannot judge a baseball situation when you have a guy on his first game in a while (as in months) facing the best 3B in baseball and one of the best OF in baseball as his first two hitters.

[Hmark6]

Wow, that's smart, posting a topic title "Schilling gets lit up" in the Sox forum.

I did it to tweak guys like you. Deal with it. I'd also like to hear a good reason why Mike Timlin isn't the closer from Sox fans.

On the closer note: If Schilling cannot be effective for one inning, then why would he be effective for 7 or 8? That's their thinking. He won't be in there permanently, only to get his strength up.

If Schilling cannot be effective for one inning, then give the ball to Mike Timlin in the 9th. It's seems elementary to me.

Last night, Francona's hands were tied. If you check Timlin's game log, he is often only good for about one inning.

You've got a point. Who else was Francona suppose to bring in at that point? That's a fair point, but I'm thinking Francona might have been able to aviod that situation altogether. Have Timlin ready for the 9th, and have Schilling try to bridge the gap in rather than the other way around. That way Schilling would not have been facing A-Rod and Sheffield. I'm Monday-Morning-Quarterback-ing here, but I was shocked that Mike Timlin didn't get the job after Foulke went down.

I can see the concept of Timlin in the closer role, but you simply cannot judge a baseball situation when you have a guy on his first game in a while (as in months) facing the best 3B in baseball and one of the best OF in baseball as his first two hitters.

Such is the role of a closer. If he wasn't ready, then why did Francona run him out there? If you're unsure about his effectiveness, why use him to get the toughest out of the ball game? Francona painted himself into a corner in the 9th inning. At that point bringing in Schill was the right move, but he might have been able to avoid it. Throw Schilling after Myers gets you out of the 6th. Or in the 8th after Popi gives you the lead instead of running Embree out there again.

[Fishercat]

I don't have to deal with it. I could easily delete this topic for trolling based simply on the topic title.

This is simply to get his arm strength up and to see if he is healthy enough to do it. Maybe he couldn't get out two of the elite hitters in baseball since it was his first start back off of injury. Who's to say that Timlin could have done it? Who's to say Schilling could have gotten out of the 8th? This is a complete monday-morning QB job. I didn't see you on here touting Timlin as the better choice when we had the discussion before, yet you feel the need to come on here now and use hindsight. Great job chief.

BTW, Schilling isn't the closer any more than Timlin is. If you had listened over the past week and change, it will go by situation between him and Timlin and others. Taking a quote from another user here.

"I don't think they will pursue a closer necessarily but they definitely are going after bullpen help. Schilling isn't the long term answer, and why would he? If he's 100% and ready to go, the best place to utilize him is at the front of the rotation. Obviously right now he's not, so it's an interesting way to help him get back to form and to strengthen a weakness on the Sox in the short term."

He is just going to the pen. Tonight he could be brought in the 7th. Last night, Francona saw a need for their most reliable bullpen man in the 8th instead of the 9th or he made a mistake.

If Schilling cannot be effective for one inning, than why did the Sox even call him up? What's his use? He blew the game last night, as did many other players. The Yankees played a better game and Schilling made two bad pitches (although people have argued Sheffield was K'ed and the ump blew the call, that's beside the point) to give the Yankees two runs. You have to give Schilling his shot sometime, and it was going to be during that game whether he was going to face the top or middle of the order.

[Providence A's]

I don't have to deal with it. I could easily delete this topic for trolling based simply on the topic title.

he's just teasing ya fisher and he brought up some interesting points...I'm sure you'll have plenty to say after the Sox crush the yanks tonight.

[Providence A's]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?id=2106975

Here's an ESPN story by that guy that rights for the PROJO here in RI...

It's believed the knee contributed greatly to Foulke's inability to command and the alarming drop in his velocity. When he returns -- probably late August or September -- the Red Sox believe he can again be a top-notch closer. This is, after all, a reliever who hasn't posted an ERA higher than 2.97 in his last six seasons and whose 165 saves rank among the most in the game over the last five years.

[rockin500]

i just dont like the idea of schilling closing. he should get into the swing of things first.

[Hmark6]

I don't have to deal with it. I could easily delete this topic for trolling based simply on the topic title.

At least you don't take yourself to seriously.

This is simply to get his arm strength up and to see if he is healthy enough to do it. Maybe he couldn't get out two of the elite hitters in baseball since it was his first start back off of injury. Who's to say that Timlin could have done it? Who's to say Schilling could have gotten out of the 8th? This is a complete monday-morning QB job. I didn't see you on here touting Timlin as the better choice when we had the discussion before, yet you feel the need to come on here now and use hindsight. Great job chief.

Get his arm strenght up? They have a place for that! It's called Triple A. Not against the hated Yankees who have a shot at getting within a half game of 1st place. I'm not saying Timlin would have shut the door on the Yanks the other night, but I am saying that he was more deserving of the oppertunity than Schilling. I didn't tout Timlin before, because I don't run to the Red Sox section on S3F when I hear something on ESPNfl. All I wanted to hear was what you guys thought of Francona's decision. And to tweak you a little bit. You're just too sensative, and got offened. It seems like your a Schilling guy. I'm sure theres some Sox fans that are Timlin guys.

You have to give Schilling his shot sometime, and it was going to be during that game whether he was going to face the top or middle of the order.

Again, if he needs to work on his arm strength, do so in Pawtucket. If he needs a MLB start, You've got 3 against the Devil Rays coming up. Start him against them.

[Fishercat]

But you clearly took me seriously. You actually think I would delete the topic based purely on a topic title? I assume you've never seen the arguments on trolling I've had here in the past, as if there is actual content in a post, the topic title or even matter doesn't matter. In this case you provided your opinion.

Why keep him in AAA? How is he any worse than Scott Cassidy or Lenny Dinardo, the guy they would have called up. He took down the Yanks 1-2-3 on Saturday when the Sox were down by three. Not a sample size, but it shows he at least has the stuff to get people out. In two innnings, he's made two mistakes which two superb hitters nailed. He retired six in a row after that. No matter what, Schilling had to come in that game. Whether it be the 6th, 8th, or 9th, he was going to come in because Francona had no one else he could trust to give the team a shot. Who's to say he wouldn't blow it in another inning to make Timlin's appearence worthless. The 9th inning is not much more important than the 8th, both innings give you three outs to get against three major league hitters. In this case, they were more dangerous in the 9th. However, if Timlin did not allow that inherited run to score from Embree or if Embree didn't put Posada at 2nd, who knows. Maybe Schilling could have got out a guy like Cano to get in the groove. He had to face Sheffield and Rodriguez and he got burned.

The start against the Devil Rays is not much less important than appearences versus the Yankees. The Sox have to win the game to have any positive impact. If Schilling gives up 8 runs in 3 innings v. the Devil Rays, it is no better than giving up 2 runs in what has been 2 innings versus the Yankees.

It isn't all about recouperating. Partially it is, but to get him back in the groove of major league baseball. The Sox need him for the stretch run, and facing AAAA players and marginal prospects won't help him get back up to speed.

I trust the decision of my team's management since they have made very few mistakes and they have done right before. There's no reason to think what they have done is wrong. Placing Schilling in situations that John Halama could handle does no good for the Red Sox. Placing him in situations where the teams need a good showing, that's where he helps.

[Hmark6]

But you clearly took me seriously. You actually think I would delete the topic based purely on a topic title? I assume you've never seen the arguments on trolling I've had here in the past, as if there is actual content in a post, the topic title or even matter doesn't matter. In this case you provided your opinion.

Apology Accepted.

Why keep him in AAA?

Because you told me his arm strength might not be there yet.

How is he any worse than Scott Cassidy or Lenny Dinardo, the guy they would have called up.

This is conversation about Schilling and Timlin and who deserved to be the closer at the beginning of this series. I said they should have flip-flopped roles in Game 1. Cassidy and DiNardo have nothing to do with anything.

The start against the Devil Rays is not much less important than appearences versus the Yankees. The Sox have to win the game to have any positive impact. If Schilling gives up 8 runs in 3 innings v. the Devil Rays, it is no better than giving up 2 runs in what has been 2 innings versus the Yankees. It isn't all about recouperating. Partially it is, but to get him back in the groove of major league baseball. The Sox need him for the stretch run, and facing AAAA players and marginal prospects won't help him get back up to speed.

You're right about all of this, but its still fishy why you would put a guy just coming back from a substantial injury into to closer role over the guy who has been mowing guys down all year. That why I'm posting here. If he needs to get back into the "groove" of MLB, couldn't you think of a better role to do so in rather than as the closer against the Yankees?

I trust the decision of my team's management since they have made very few mistakes and they have done right before. There's no reason to think what they have done is wrong. Placing Schilling in situations that John Halama could handle does no good for the Red Sox. Placing him in situations where the teams need a good showing, that's where he helps.

That's fair. I think Francona earned the benefit of the doubt by winning the ring last year. I just thought it was a curious decision, thats all.